Training Frequency and Protein Intake

The Serious Strength team of instructors are a unique bunch of dedicated professionals. I have the honor of working with them each and every day. One of the best things we all share is the common belief that if we can make the training better or more productive for the client (all the while focusing on safety), we should.

In other words, we are not tied to a way of training for the sake of sticking to a set and previously accepted training paradigm. No - we are all instead tied to obeying well done research and, when we discover new training territory - even if it disagrees with what we are currently doing for clients (and even if the evidence is purely anecdotal), we strongly consider it.

Case in point, I  just received this email from one of our instructors:

“Fred - Update: I weighed 154 pounds in November."

(Note: he was training 1-2X a week for many months and gained well, but was topped out at 160lbs. He asked me what to do and I said add a training day and see what happens. He is NOT a 'genetic freak' meaning, he is not someone who has the genetics for super-man like muscles.) 

"I started training 3x a week in January. When I started, I weighed 160. 13.6% body fat.

Today is 3 months of 3x week training and eating more. I weigh 167 and my body fat is 11.5%. I have put on a little under 10 pounds of muscle.

Woohooo!”

Woohoo indeed. Now to make further gains I feel he'll need to up his fat/protein intake a tad more and perhaps add a tad more volume to each session.Bear in mind that he is trying to maximize his muscle mass. Most people are not interested in doing this. One or better still two weekly strength training sessions are more than enough to halt and reverse sarcopenia (age related muscle loss) so long as you are eating enough protein. If you do not eat enough protein you will lose lean tissue at an accelerated rate. And that's bad!

If the key to productive training is recovery from the training (and it most certainly is), then logically we need to boost recovery if we are not seeing the gains we wish to see. To boost recovery, we need to eat enough fat and protein and keep carbohydrate low to moderate. But the timing of the protein intake is CRITICAL.

This is something I had not fully considered for the past 20 years. Now, due to some very good research, I hold a different view.

I just returned from the 2009 Eastern Regional Obesity Conference hosted by the American Society of Bariatric Physicians which included the Nutrition and Metabolism Symposium in Charleston South Carolina. One of the speakers, Dr. Douglass Paddon-Jones, presented some extremely well done research indicating that if one is not getting at least 30 grams of protein per meal and especially at breakfast, muscle loss is accelerated. And you can't make up for it by eating 60 grams (even if you could) at lunch. If you miss the window, you miss it. This is especially important for seniors who usually shun protein because of the fat content which they have wrongfully been told is bad for their health. The 'lipophobes' (fat haters) are everywhere in the medical community and it is causing our seniors a slow and painful demise. Sad indeed.

So, even though more frequent strength training sessions seems to maximize lean mass gains a bit better (so long as adequate protein is ingested), it is still very apparent that 30-40 minutes of training twice per week is sufficient for good gains. BUT again, the frequency and timing of the protein intake is a major player.

There is a good deal of research which indicates that people have a wide variety of recovery times. But in these studies, the researchers fail to address diet. The fact is that some people eat a lot better than others for anabolism (lean growth) even though they are not consciously trying.  

As the saying goes: Eat, train, grow.

My twist to this is:

Eat enough, train enough, grow better.

Comments

[fred hahn]

That is correct. But no one knows exactly what the perfect amount is. The idea is to make sure you take in adequate amounts for your size. 1.2 - 1.5gms per pound of lean body weight.

Here's a good resource for protein intake:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/the-protein-book

[Matt]

Fred, I find the flat 30g recommendation curious. I would think there should be some sort of height and/or weight scale? 20g for a 5'0 woman, 40g for a 6'2 man?

[K Dill]

How would you break up the exercises for a 3 day a week routine? In your book, you divide the exercises into two routines with out a lot of overlap. Would you recommend alternating them or dividing them further?

[Brandon Schultz, D.C.]

Fred -
I too have noticed I need 2-3 training sessions per week to keep optimal muscular size and strength. Do you think the one training day per week is for advanced trainees?
Is there a difference between strength gains and actual muscular hypertrophy? If all you do is measure strength gains and not body composition, are you being totally thorough with the "results" of training?
Thank you for this interesting blog post, there is a lot here to process.
In health
Brandon

[Lynn]

Fred -

Tought you find this web site...well, amusing.

"Strongest Man http://strongestman.org/
is a website dedicated to providing critical information to make you the strongest man that you can be."

Maybe I'll try the twice-a-day routine. ;)

Lynn

[Al]

Hey Fred,

What do you think the optimal amount of protein per gram of bodyweight is? That would allow us to determine how many meals a day we should be eating if the optimal amount of protein is 30grams in one sitting.

Thanks,

Al

[Fred Hahn]

Ryan - Sorry I don't have the research by Dr. Padden-Jones. I will try to contact him and if I can get it I'll post a link to it here at a later date.

Thanks for reading!

[Fred Hahn]

Hi Valerie,

I agree with your food ideas. I am fairly sure that glucose created via gluconeogenesis should not be a factor to worry about if you are eating the proper amount. A lot of protein raises insulin but not blood sugar to any great degree.

I look forward to meeting you too!!

[Fred Hahn]

Kab - as far as I know the conversion of protein to glucose via gluconeogenesis should not be a problem for you as a type 2 diabetic.

Has it been?

[Fred Hahn]

Hey Brandon -

I have always recommended 2 weekly workouts, not one. I am now starting to understand the critical role nutrition plays in recovery - especially protein intake. New research indicates that the amount and timing of protein can make a critical difference in how quickly one can recover from training. I believe that 3 weekly sessions, full body, can be productive - even more productive than 2 but only if you feed yourself properly.

Thanks for reading and for your compliment.

[Brandon Schultz, D.C.]

Good morning Fred and everyone!
I was curious when you speak of an increase in training frequency, are you referring to:
1) Splitting up Slowburn into multiple days of training
OR
2) Performing the entire Slowburn workout more than once in a weeks time

Thank you very much for the interesting and information-dense blog!
In health
Brandon

[Valerie Berkowitz, MS, RD, CDE]

Hi Fred,

The comments on protein are interesting.

20-30 grams of protein translates into 3-5 oz of protein.

I typically recommend 2-4 oz. protein at breakfast, 6-8 oz. at lunch and dinner and 2-3 oz. for snack. This is based on an individuals hunger or body size. A larger/taller person may need more and a smaller person may need a little less.

As for the egg comment, why not try 2 eggs a wild berry burst whey protein green drink made with a healthy fat, ie coconut or flax oil?

This gives you a balance of protein, high antioxidants (especially needed for workouts) and healthy fats.

Yes protein will affect blood sugar. You may be able to trouble shoot the affects of blood sugar with different food combinations, ie healthy fats (avocado, coconut) with protein and if it helps increase protein by an ounce or 2

or

use peanut butter with celery as a snack between meals to decrease total glucose load in one sitting by spreading out in 6 smaller meals.

trial and error will help your problem.

You are doing good things for people Fred! I hope to meet you one day soon.

[Brandon Schultz, D.C.]

Hello all!
My question is: what is the program of 3x/wk? Is it the Slowburn workout divided into three sections or is it the entire workout performed 3x/wk?
I have always seemed to gain more muscle when performing more than 1 workout per week, but I was curious how this trainee broke down their training. Thank you for any and all responses!
In health
Brandon

[Kab]

Fred,

Marco raises a good question. I would like to start the "Slow Burn" and I know I need sufficient protein to do so. However, I am a Type 2 diabetic, female, age 57 who controls blood glucose solely through diet (A1c 5.6) so I eat very little carbs (5 - 10 gms/meal 3x/day). A certain percentage of protein can be converted into glucose if the body needs it for energy. Since I eat so few carbs my body seems to want to convert any protein above and beyond the protein in 2 - 3 oz of meat or one egg into glucose! It's very frustrating. Do you know how I can manage to eat more protein without having this conversion occur?

[Marco]

Fred,

Maybe, in Jeff Volek's opinion, the right amount would be about 20 grams per meal.

"Consuming more than 20g per serving results in a marked increase in burning of protein as fuel instead of as a source of protein synthesis."
(http://tinyurl.com/ct9g2p)

[Ryan Lee]

HI Fred,

I was wondering if you have a link to Dr. Paddon-Jones' research, if it's available online.

Ryan

[Nick Georgis]

Hi Fred,

Thank you for the post.

You said:

"So, even though more frequent strength training sessions seems to maximize lean mass gains a bit better (so long as adequate protein is ingested), it is still very apparent that 30-40 minutes of training twice per week is sufficient for good gains. BUT again, the frequency and timing of the protein intake is a major player."

I have two questions I am hoping you will address. First, in an earlier post you recommend eating protien just before and after a training session. Assuming one could eat dinner after a late afternoon session, eating protein before the session would mean additional protein and calories between the 30gms targeted for each meal. Do you still recommend adding something like a protein shake before a workout given your timing comment above?

Second, you also say we need at least two 30-40 minute training sessions per week. My slow-burn sessions usually don't last more than 25 minutes. What do you recommend one do to extend the time of their workout (i.e., add machines, run)?

Thank you,
Nick

[Tom]

30 grams of protein per meal? Wow...that's five eggs, per meal!

[Al]

Fred,

Great and very informative post. Thank you.

A couple of questions. What do you think the reason is that a slight increase in frequency will increase LBM?

Second, what do you think the ideal amount of protein grams per pound of body weight is?

Third, what do you think is the single best text regarding diet and increasing LBM?

Regards,

Al

[Fred Hahn]

I'm no longer a fan of IF. I tried and and only experienced muscle loss and loss of strength. Perhaps in obese people it works better but for both my wife and myself we found If to be detrimental.

Dr. Jones showed us that additional protein did not produce better outcomes. 60 grams showed barely any superiority over 30gms. But these are in untrained subjects.

[Joe Matasic]

I think I may have read the paper your talking about last week. I believe it was by Donald Layman. Dr. Eades linked to it in a response to a question someone posted. It was a the same info 30 at least per meal, especially at breakfast. I believe he said that 30 gram would be the minimum for recovery and metabolic process and additional benefits could be seen in extra protein consumption. Breakfast was important for two reasons, I think, one was the meal from being in a fasted state and two the protein having a suppressive effect on caloric intake later in the day.

My question is that I've been doing IF to try and break though a plateau and for the other benefits. I read this and I wondered about how it would work with IF. Is it only at actual meals that its needed? For example if you are fasting and don't eat breakfast or lunch, is that detrimental or should just every time I eat have at least 30 grams of protein? Thus possibly no snacks? The paper Dr. Eades linked didn't make are of this clear. Maybe the presentation was more clear. Maybe I should switch my one of my fasting days out farther from after I lift?

Actually, I just looked the paper up and the first reference in Layman's paper is by Paddon-Jones. So they're not the same. I'll have to see if I can track down that one.